Secret Life...

Ummm is it just me or is Mackenzie Rosman a biatch in this show?? I was quite surprised. I am used to seeing her goody two shoes attitude on 7th heaven. And now it's like, whaaaaat??? Anyway, just wondering what everyone thought about that. I thought it was so funny what she said to Adrian in the hallway, because she DOES deserve what happened to her. Right on! She's a biatch, but very truthful.
Wait, this should be in the media one. Oops! Sorry Unit.

I didn't care for the scene. Yes, Adrian brought the situation on herself. But the 7th Heaven chick who JUST spent the night with Ricky basically calling her a slut? Hypocritical bitches are annoying. Adrian should have knocked her ass out.

*moved to media*

Thanks Unit. I agree, but what she said was describing Adrian. But Zoe is a slut too, so she is being a hypocrite.
Something makes me think that Adrian still hasn't learned her lesson. What an idiot.

Oh and I should mention, I thought what Tom did was sooooooooo cute! And how she cried. Awww!

Courtnut wrote:Oh and I should mention, I thought what Tom did was sooooooooo cute! And how she cried. Awww!

That was the only part of the episode that i liked. Tom is so sweet

This episode actually made me feel bad for Ben and Adrian!

Everyone feels bad for ben and adrian but when ricky and amy were in this situation everyone hated ricky and thought amy should have known better. They called her a spoiled brat and said she needed to grow up.

If anything ben and adrian are acting like a couple of children about this.. at least ricky and amy stepped up to the plate and did the right things.

nicole519 wrote:

If anything ben and adrian are acting like a couple of children about this.. at least ricky and amy stepped up to the plate and did the right things.

What exactly are the right things? What is right for one isn't necessarily right for another. Everybody's different.

And why do people feel bad for Ben and Adrian? They did it to themselves. If they weren't ready for a child, they shouldn't have done it.
In this situation, giving the child up for adoption or keeping it would be the best. Ben doesn't want an abortion, and Adrian wants it for her own stupid selfish reasons.
Agreed, I thought Amy and Ricky were immature about there pregnancy, until I saw Ben and Adrian. Amy almost did the wrong thing, but she just couldn't do it. Adrian on the other hand, doesn't seem to have a conscience.

And why do people feel bad for Ben and Adrian? They did it to
themselves. If they weren't ready for a child, they shouldn't have done
it.

So by this logic if you don't feel ready to get hit by a car and be paralyzed for the rest of your life you shouldn't have crossed the streets? Everything in life is a risk

In this situation, giving the child up for adoption or keeping it would
be the best.

I don't see how it would be the best for Adrian

Ben doesn't want an abortion, and Adrian wants it for her own stupid
selfish reasons.

What's wrong with being selfish? Pregnancy is not exactly the easiest or safest thing in the world.

Abortions are actually pretty dangerous. When she had sex she decided the consequences therefore she needs to stop thinking of just herself in this picture and think more about the baby and Ben and everyone else.
I can't believe her mother is supporting her killing their grandchild.

Abortions are actually pretty dangerous

Yup. And both pregnancy and birth are dangerous

When she had sex she decided the consequences

Again. You know the possible consequences of crossing the street as well. If you get hit by a car should we be dismissive and say "she knew the consequences of crossing the road?"

she needs to stop thinking of just herself in this picture

Why not. It's her life which will be ruined by this.

I can't believe her mother is supporting her killing their grandchild.

I would too if this was my daughter.

If you were jaywalking, then yes.
Her life will only ruined for about 9 months. And she's already a couple months in. So what would be the point in killing the baby rather then wait a few months and give it up?? Rather then her regretting her decision it's probably a safer route to just give it up.
Like I said, she chose to have sex, she chooses the consequences. She used sex recklessly, and this was going to happen sooner or later.
Amy did it once and got pregnant, and never did it again. And somehow she was able to do the right thing and be mature about it when Adrian isn't.
And by the way, it is not just her baby. It's Ben's too. He should have a say in it. It's not only her baby.

Courtnut wrote:If you were jaywalking, then yes.
Her life will only ruined for about 9 months. And she's already a couple months in. So what would be the point in killing the baby rather then wait a few months and give it up?? Rather then her regretting her decision it's probably a safer route to just give it up.
Like I said, she chose to have sex, she chooses the consequences. She used sex recklessly, and this was going to happen sooner or later.
Amy did it once and got pregnant, and never did it again. And somehow she was able to do the right thing and be mature about it when Adrian isn't.
And by the way, it is not just her baby. It's Ben's too. He should have a say in it. It's not only her baby.

First off. They used protection and all that stuff. So in the analogy with the Car, even if you were using crosswalks and such, you were using 'protection' but you still knew the risks of crossing the road. A drunk driver, a person driving recklessly, someone falling asleep at the wheel, these are all possibilities. These are possible consequences. Despite you trying to use 'protection.'

You knew the risks.

last I checked, you don't really choose the consequences.

Also apparently Child Birth IS more dangerous then abortion. Though not sure how unbiased this site is http://www.womenonweb.org/article-237-en.html in most deaths resulting from abortion it was done in unsafe areas.

I don't mean unsafe as in death. I mean for future problems like infertility and cervical cancer. It is pretty much just like giving birth, but to a smaller baby. I actually heard that having an abortion is much worse then giving birth.

Courtnut wrote:I don't mean unsafe as in death. I mean for future problems like infertility and cervical cancer. It is pretty much just like giving birth, but to a smaller baby. I actually heard that having an abortion is much worse then giving birth.

There is no definitive link between Abortion and Cervical Cancer. To quote an article

Overall, however, there is not enough information on abortion and cervical cancer to advise someone against making the decision. The chances of experiencing cervical cancer due to giving birth are much higher than the chances of experiencing cervical cancer due to an abortion.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/2587759/does_abortion_cause_cervical_cancer_pg2.html?cat=52

It also goes into reasons as to why woman MIGHT be more at risk. But these are factors unrelated to the actual abortion(smoking, multiple partners, alcohol, and other drugs) All of those listed make it hard for the body to get rid of HPV, the cause of Cervical Cancer.

As for Infirtility. Well...

From what I have read. This is very very rare. In fact in most cases its because of an infection they get afterwards. Which is usually caused by the abortion being done in unsafe conditions.

A study done in 2004 had come to the conclusion that Medical Abortions had no impact on fertility at all. Especially within the first 10 or so weeks of pregnancy.

http://www.justmommies.com/articles/abortion-infertility.shtml

You sure are getting some crappy studies.
Well, woohoo for you supporting abortion.

Courtnut wrote:You sure are getting some crappy studies.
Well, woohoo for you supporting abortion.

This is the part where you put your own articles/studies up. Hell I didn't even bother to check if they were somehow biased. Now find some article/study that shows otherwise. You have yet to even bother putting up anything to defend your claims. But you keep going on about how there is some connection, about how the articles I have chosen were crap. But you don't bother to actually refute them. Why is that?


I am pro choice. I believe I have no say what so ever when it comes to a womans choice. Thats her choice, not mine. I don't believe I have the right to deny her this option, and even if I did I know better. Otherwise we go back to back alley abortions. but its their choice, I wont try and stop them if they decide for it.

I would stop it if it was my baby. If I personally wanted the baby and the girl didn't, I don't think it's fair for her to kill it.
Maybe because I'm not like you guys, so bent on proving someone wrong that I'm going to go out of my way to research it. Because it's not going to change my opinion.
Pro choice to me means they chose to open their legs. Knowing what could happen. No baby should be ripped apart and have their brain sucked out or be poisoned to death just for a womans dumb choice.

Courtnut wrote:I would stop it if it was my baby. If I personally wanted the baby and the girl didn't, I don't think it's fair for her to kill it.
Maybe because I'm not like you guys, so bent on proving someone wrong that I'm going to go out of my way to research it. Because it's not going to change my opinion.
Pro choice to me means they chose to open their legs. Knowing what could happen. No baby should be ripped apart and have their brain sucked out or be poisoned to death just for a womans dumb choice.

Then don't talk about it as if you know what you are well talking about. Don't go off saying stuff that just isn't true or has no scientific/medical backing. I don't like it when people are ignorant about what they are talking about and spreading lies. So when I see something questionable I do a bit of research to get the full details on it. If they are wrong or grossly exaggerating it I make it a point to try and correct them.

Also why do I find it so disturbing that you would say that?(bolded) I mean are you serious? Everytime I hear a female talk about it that way as if its a matter of fact disturbs the hell out of me. Why?

Because I am sure that person, who screamed and fought, just 'chose' to open her legs willingly. What that of incest? Did she really open her legs to her father/uncle/brother willingly? It couldn't have been forced upon her. Well not if she wants to get an abortion.

I hate, I despise, people who become to general like that.

What about being drugged? Sure at the time they may have been into it, but they had no legal way of consenting. Such drugs interfere with ones ability to make an informed decision.

Oh but if she chooses to get one. She must have consented right?

Also Medical Abortion doesn't poison them. In fact it's mostly a hormone blocker. It blocks the hormones needed to sustain a pregnancy.

Courtnut wrote:
Well, woohoo for you supporting abortion.

I don't think anybody really "supports" abortion, pro-choicers support the right for women to have control over their bodies. It's not like those of us who are pro-choice jump right to that one like it's some easy decision to make. All options should be considered, and as long as it's still legal, abortion is one of the options. Whether or not they choose to go down that path is between the woman and her doctor, and she shouldn't be looked at, or treated any differently for it. It's her choice to make, and whether the decision is "right" or "wrong" depends on the woman and HER beliefs, not anybody else's.

I have been in that situation. And no it is not the babies fault it was conceived that way. She can deal with it for 9 months then give it away. And I do know what I am talking about and I'm sure a lot of doctors do too. I find it hard to believe that 80% of women love the fact they had an abortion. If taken from the general population it is a lot lower I am sure.
I didn't say it was fact. I said that that is what I believe. I'm not like you, I don't go looking for false researches to prove someone wrong. I believe what I believe, and that is it.
I have had many babies die in my life, and I don't understand how murdering one solves any problems.

Courtnut wrote:I have been in that situation. And no it is not the babies fault it was conceived that way. She can deal with it for 9 months then give it away. And I do know what I am talking about and I'm sure a lot of doctors do too. I find it hard to believe that 80% of women love the fact they had an abortion. If taken from the general population it is a lot lower I am sure.
I didn't say it was fact. I said that that is what I believe. I'm not like you, I don't go looking for false researches to prove someone wrong. I believe what I believe, and that is it.
I have had many babies die in my life, and I don't understand how murdering one solves any problems.

Oh I love how you twist my words! Brilliant, really brilliant. Not once did I say that they LOVED it I said that they didn't regret it according to a study they did. So please don't try and twist my words like that. You only look stupid.

There you go again! False research? Then enlighten me. Show me your studies. I beg of you. Show that my articles and the studies used, are false. Go on, do it.


Beliving one thing, and saying its fact is. Well Not fact. I can believe that there is a giant spaceship in my backyard. Doesn't mean its true. I can believe that AIDS doesn't exist, I can believe that HIV doesn't become AIDS. I can even believe that your first time you can't get pregnant. But guess what? None of that is true.

So please do not go around claiming things as fact and then just offer up the 'its what I believe' bull crap. I can believe in alot of things, doesn't mean they are all going to be correct.

So either bring up your own studies from unbiased sources to dispute it.

You know what I really hate though?

Is when people can't have the balls to actually have a discussion on this place. Everyone falls into 'Its what I believe, why are you persecuting me?' Anytime someone tries to dispute something they said, they almost always fall back on this.

Sometimes I wish I people were more like the ones at the Series Discussion section at a forum I go to. Now they can go into good discussion bringing up graphs, articles, and all that sort of stuff.

Her life will only ruined for about 9 months. And she's already a couple
months in.

Actually it can be ruined for a lot longer. Especially in a critical age like the teen years. And 9 months is really not that little. Life is not that long and 9 months are a lot

So what would be the point in killing the baby rather then wait a few
months and give it up??

It's not a baby. While still in the abortion limit most fetuses are pretty much a cluster of cells.

Like I said, she chose to have sex, she chooses the consequences. She
used sex recklessly, and this was going to happen sooner or later.

Again show me an example of how this is different then every single aspect of life. we constantly take risks. This does not mean we chose the consequences. It means we simply have to deal with them

Amy did it once and got pregnant, and never did it again.

I am no expert on the show but hasn't it been done just a few months or an year since she got pregnant. The windowd is still opened for a lot of mistakes

And by the way, it is not just her
baby. It's Ben's too. He should have a say in it. It's not only her
baby.

Hey I am a man. I would love to have me some rights but the simple facts remains is that it's not my uterus that will be carrying for the next 9 months. Until we develop artificial wombs and a safe procedure to transfer embryo the women should have all the rights as far the prgenancy is concerned. Of course this does raises some questions about the balance between right and responsibility question but in the end it comes down to the simple fact it's not my body

Maybe because I'm not like you guys, so bent on proving someone wrong
that I'm going to go out of my way to research it. Because it's not
going to change my opinion.
I didn't say it was fact. I said that that is what I believe. I'm not
like you, I don't go looking for false researches to prove someone
wrong. I believe what I believe, and that is it.

Look I get that you feel emotional about this but man just read at what your posting. You can do better then this

I have been in that situation. .

No you haven't so you can't possibly know about these women